InvestorLine | Financial Crooks

As I continue to collect and combine our RRSP investments, I recently moved money from our Tangerine RRSPs to our InvestorLine and Investor’s Edge RRSPs; To add more interest to a dull bookkeeping task, I started both transfers on the same day to see which brokerage was faster.

UPDATE: Please be aware that as of January 2015, Tangerine has started charging a fee if you transfer your RRSP or TFSA from Tangerine to another bank, credit union, brokerage or financial institution.

Is It Easier to Initiate a Transfer to InvestorLine or Investor’s Edge?

For some strange reason, CIBC still requires you to visit a branch to finalize a T2033 to transfer funds into an Investor’s Edge account. Technically, the branch is supposed to add their contact information to the form before it is sent in to the Wholesale Brokerage by fax.

I guess you could cheat and try faxing it in yourself without this info but since I needed to return something to our safe deposit box, I just took the form to the branch.
InvestorLine lets you mail in the T2033.

When Did the Money Leave Our Tangerine RRSPs?

We mailed and faxed the two T2033s on June 19.

On June 30, the money left one Tangerine account headed towards Investor’s Edge.
On the morning of July 2, the money was gone from the other Tangerine RRSP on its way to InvestorLine.

Who Won? And When Did the Money Land in Our Brokerage Accounts?

BMO InvestorLine won. The RRSP money landed in the cash balance of that account on Saturday, July 5, back-dated to July 4.

CIBC Investor’s Edge finished a close second. The RRSP money landed in the cash balance of that account on Tuesday, July 8, back-dated to July 7.

Why Does It Take So Long After Leaving Tangerine to Land In the Brokerage Account?

I’m beginning to suspect part of the delay is that usual “hold” banks and brokerages put on funds. Since this is a transfer from an external bank to the brokerage, they may be putting a hold for 2-5 business days on the funds.

I know from experience that once the cash is in the brokerage accounts there is no hold on it and I can invest it right away.

Why Do I Keep Having To Transfer RRSP Money from Tangerine In the First Place?

I keep a lot of money in GICs. You generally can’t transfer most GICs into a brokerage account. For sure, you can’t transfer ING Direct/Tangerine GICs.

Yes, I could actually cash out our Tangerine GICs early but that would require forfeiting most of the interest. Instead, I just wait till they mature and then shift the money over.

Now, I usually buy GICs in our brokerage accounts in the first place. But we didn’t have brokerage accounts 5 years ago. My goal of consolidating, simplifying and improving our RRSP investments is a fairly recent one. (Which correlates strongly with the time the children grew old enough to give me some free time in the evenings.)

For now, everything’s moved that can be. So now we wait for the big market crash. Or not.

Related Reading

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Have you noticed a delay between when money disappears from one RRSP and when it reappears in another? Does it seem to take 2-5 business days? Please share your experiences with a comment.

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Most online self-directed brokerages offer RESPs within which you can receive the Canada Education Savings Grant, CESG. There are other grants and incentives available for some children, however, that not all brokerages are set up to handle. This is gradually changing as brokerages improve their offerings, so for the most up to date information, always speak with the brokerage you are considering. As of May 2014, however, this list summarizes which RESP grants, incentives and bonds are supported by which of the bigger self-directed brokerages.

What Government Grants, Bonds and Incentives Are on Offer for Children’s Education Savings?

I found information about the following federal and provincial government grants, bonds, incentives and programs to help save money for children’s higher education. There may be other programs: if you know of one, please add a comment to this article.

Federal Government Education Savings Programs

Canada Education Savings Grant, CESG: To read more click: http://www.servicecanada.gc.ca/eng/goc/cesg.shtml
Additional Education Savings Grant, AESG: To read more click: http://www.canlearn.ca/eng/savings/a-cesg.shtml
Canada Learning Bond, CLB: To read more click:
http://www.canlearn.ca/eng/savings/clb.shtml

Provincial Government Education Savings Programs

Quebec Education Savings Incentive, QESI, Basic and Additional Amount: To read more click:
http://www4.gouv.qc.ca/EN/Portail/Citoyens/Evenements/DevenirParent/Pages/incitf_eparg_etud.aspx
Alberta Centennial Education Savings Plan, ACES: To read more click: http://eae.alberta.ca/funding/aces.aspx/
Saskatchewan Advantage Grant for Education Savings, SAGES: To read more click: http://www.saskatchewan.ca/live/education-learning-and-child-care/saving-for-post-secondary-education

Government Education Funds and Self-Directed Brokerages

In order for your child to get paid various government funds for higher education, the financial institution managing your child’s RESP must set up systems that meet the various government requirements. Not all brokerages have set up the required computer systems so they don’t all support all of the possible government programs available.
Before you choose a brokerage for your child’s RESP, one factor to consider is whether that brokerage supports the grants, bonds, programs and incentives your child is entitled to receive.

(Other factors may include things like

whether there is an annual fee for the account;
whether both parents can be subscribers and share rights to the account;
what the costs are to make various types of investments;
how easy or difficult it is to withdraw funds from the account when your child starts post-secondary education;
etc.)

The brokerages are listed in alphabetical order.

BMO InvestorLine RESPs Can Receive

the

Canada Education Savings Grant, CESG *
Additional Education Savings Grant, AESG *
Canada Learning Bond, CLB *
Alberta Centennial Education Savings Plan, ACES *
Quebec Education Savings Incentive, QESI, Basic and Additional Amount

Source: https://www.bmoinvestorline.com/home/getting-started/il/accounts/resp
*This information is also listed on the gc site.

There is no mention on the BMO website about whether they can receive the Saskatchewan Advantage Grant for Education Savings, SAGES. On the gc website, it does not report that InvestorLine can manage this grant.

CIBC Investor’s Edge RESPs Can Receive

the

Canada Education Savings Grant, CESG
Alberta Centennial Education Savings Plan, ACES
Quebec Education Savings Incentive, QESI

Investor’s Edge is not listed on the gc site at all.

I used the LiveChat feature to ask a CIBC Investor’s Edge representative what grants were supported. The agent replied: “CIBC Investor’s Edge currently offers the basic CESG, Alberta Centennial Education Savings Plan (ACES) and Quebec Education Savings Incentive (QESI).”

If you needed to receive the AESG or QESI additional amount I would suggest you confirm with CIBC IE before opening an account. It sounds like they may not be offered at this time (May 2014.)

Questrade RESPs Can Receive

the

Canada Education Savings Grant, CESG *
Additional Education Savings Grant, AESG *
Canada Learning Bond, CLB *
Alberta Centennial Education Savings Plan, ACES *
Quebec Education Savings Incentive, QESI

* This information is listed on the gc site.

The Questrade site only mentions the CESG, AESG and CLB. So I used Questrade’s online chat to ask an agent what is supported. He replied that all of the above government programs are supported and that they do not yet support the SAGES grant.

RBC Direct Investing RESPs Can Receive

the

Canada Education Savings Grant, CESG *
Quebec Education Savings Incentive, QESI

Source: http://www.rbcdirectinvesting.com/resp-account.html
*This information is also listed on the gc site.

I confirmed by sending a question via LiveChat that at this time in May 2014 those are the only grants RBC Direct Investing is supporting.

Scotia iTrade RESPs Can Receive

the

Canada Education Savings Grant, CESG
Additional Education Savings Grant, AESG
Canada Learning Bond, CLB
Alberta Centennial Education Savings Plan, ACES
Quebec Education Savings Incentive, QESI, Basic and Additional Amount

Scotia iTrade is not listed on the gc site at all.

I wrote an email to the iTrade support team. They don’t seem to have live online chat and I couldn’t find any details easily on their website. They replied 1.5 days later with the above information. The representative said that at this time (May 2014) they do not support SAGES.

TD Direct Investing RESPs Can Receive

the

Canada Education Savings Grant, CESG
Quebec Education Savings Incentive, QESI

Source: http://www.tdwaterhouse.ca/products-services/investing/td-direct-investing/accounts/resp/#content3 which states:
“TD Direct Investing offers only the Canada Education Savings Grant and the Quebec Education Savings Incentive, not any other federal or provincial grants or incentives.”

TD Direct Investing is not listed on the gc site at all.

The gc site is at: http://www.esdc.gc.ca/eng/jobs/student/promoters/list.shtml#B

The Master List of Banks, Credit Unions and Brokerages and Which Grants, Bonds and Incentives They Support

There is a massive online list available from the federal government of which institutions support which grants, bonds and incentives. It does not list the Quebec Education Savings Initiative, QESI, but it does list the CESG, AESG, CLB, ACES and Saskatchewan Advantage Grant for Education Savings, SAGES.

Transferring RESPs Between Institutions

Be VERY CAREFUL if you transfer RESPs between two institutions. There may be special paperwork required before the transfer is initiated to ensure the grant, bond or incentive monies do not have to be given back to the government that issued them. Discuss the move in detail with both institutions before you start it!