Category Archives: InvestorLine

Testing a Sell (and Buy) of AAT770 in a BMO InvestorLine Account: Part Two, the Sell

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When last I tested a sale of units in the BMO high interest savings account fund, AAT770, I was greeted with several ominous warning messages. They said that the sale could be delayed. It’s been a few months and I wondered if things had calmed down any. So as soon as my recent purchase of AAT770 had settled, I tested the system with a sale of some of the units.

Tracking a Request to Sell AAT770 from InvestorLine

Following my own instructions on how to sell AAT770, I placed a Sell order on Wednesday, July 10, 2013 before noon. (Remember mutual fund orders usually have to be placed before 2 p.m. to go through that day.)

Immediately, when I select Order Status from the Trading Tab, I am provided with the following information:

  • the original order number
  • the symbol: AAT770
  • a description: BMO High Int Sving Account(BIL)
  • the order type: Sell
  • the original order quantity: $5,000
  • the outstanding quantity: blank
  • the entry date mm/dd: 07/10 (Good thing they clarify which one is the month)
  • the expiry date mm/dd: blank
  • the average fill price: blank
  • the status: submitted

The word submitted is a link but if I click it what opens is a definition of the term.

The original order number is also a link. If I click it the Order Status Details screen opens.

That screen has the following information already (minutes after I placed the order.)

  • Original Order Number
  • Symbol: AAT770
  • Fund Name: BMO High Int Svng Account(BIL)
  • Reference Number: this is the same number as the original order number
  • Order Type: Sell
  • Order Quantity/value: $5,000
  • Load Type: No Load
  • Most Recent Closing Price: $1.00
  • Dividend Option: Reinvest
  • Settlement Funds: CAD
  • Status: Submitted (same link to the definition)
  • Activity Date/Time: 2013-07-10 10:17

And an informational note:
“This order cannot be changed or cancelled for the following reason:
•  Mutual Fund and/or Fixed Income orders cannot be changed or cancelled online.”

My account balance is also shown in a small box in the upper right side of the screen. At this point it still shows a Cash Balance that does not include the amount I have just sold.

If I click on the My Portfolio tab, I also do not see the amount I just cashed out included in my Cash balances.

At this time, the HISA fund showing on my list of Investments on the My Holdings page has not been reduced yet.

If I select Transaction History from the list under the My Portfolio tab there is not yet any transaction listed. It does not list the order to sell the fund.

Welcome Back: The Sell Continues

On Friday, July 12
Under the My Portfolio tab, in the Transaction history I see a line item:

  • Transaction Date: July 10, 2013
  • Settlement Date: July 11, 2013
  • Activity Description: Sell
  • Description: BMO High Int Svng Account (BIL)
  • Symbol: AAT770
  • Quantity: -5,000
  • Price: 1.00 C
  • Total Amount: 5,000 C

And the money is now showing up in the Cash balance if I look at the My Holdings screen and in other screens.

Did I Need to Heed the Warnings about a Slow Sale of AAT770

So even though the program is still warning me that sales of units of AAT770 may be delayed, both in the past and in July 2013 I was able to sell units and have the cash appear in my account on the morning of the second business day after the sale. According to the transaction history, the money was actually available one business day after the sale.

The Schedule of Events for the Buy and Sell of Units of the AAT770 HISA Fund

  • Monday July 8 put in a request to buy units of AAT770 before 2 p.m. ET
  • Tuesday July 9 Cash still in account. AAT770 not yet listed as owned.
  • Wednesday July 10. Cash taken out of account. AAT770 units listed in My Holdings.
  • Wednesday July 10 put in a request to sell some units of AAT770 before 2 p.m. ET
  • Thursday July 11 Cash not in account. All units of AAT770 still listed as owned.
  • Friday July 12. Cash back in account. Sold units no longer listed in My Holdings.

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Have you ever tried to cash out some of your AAT770 holding and had an unpleasant delay? Please share your experiences with a comment.

How Can I Move a Stock I Hold from the Canadian Side to the US Side of my InvestorLine Account?

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Setting up a US dollar sub-account within my InvestorLine RRSP account was easy. I just had to pick up the phone and speak to an InvestorLine rep. The trickier part was deciding what to hold in the US ledger and how to get it there. As a first step, I decided to test transferring some shares of a stock from the Canadian dollar side of my account to the US dollar side.

Here’s what happened.

Picking a Stock to Move from CAD to USD in my Account

I had some TD shares in my regular InvestorLine account. I had bought them on the TSX using Canadian dollars. They pay me my dividends in Canadian dollars. Since I bought some of them during the recent fire sale, they display a tidy little capital gain in the gains and losses column.

TD is also listed on the stock exchange in New York. If Americans buy it from that exchange, they pay US dollars for their shares. They are paid the quarterly dividend in US dollars. If they sell their holding, they are paid in US dollars.

A stock that is held on two (or more) exchanges like this is sometimes called inter-listed.

But you don’t have to be an American to buy TD shares on the NYSE or to sell them on it. Your self-directed brokerage may let you hold stocks in a US dollar ledger and lets you keep your profits in a US dollar cash account or money market fund. BMO InvestorLine allows this.

So I decided to move some shares of TD from the Canadian side of my account to the US side and watch what happened.

How to Transfer Shares from the Canadian to the US Journal for an InvestorLine Account

At this time (July 2013) to move shares from the Canadian dollar journal for my InvestorLine RRSP to the US dollar journal, I have to phone InvestorLine.

  1. Call InvestorLine at 1 888 776 6886.
  2. Provide your InvestorLine account number and your access password.
  3. Ask the agent to transfer the correct number of shares from your Canadian dollar account to your US dollar account.

Can I Transfer Just Some of My Shares to the US Side of my InvestorLine Account?

Being someone who likes testing things, I requested to transfer only 100 of my TD shares to my US dollar ledger. InvestorLine was quite agreeable and had no problem leaving the rest of the shares in my Canadian dollar ledger.

The agent did warn me, though, that for a day or two I will see the shares listed twice. He cautioned me not to over-estimate my holdings while waiting for the record keeping to straighten out. I assured him I wouldn’t sell shares I don’t have.

Can I Request a Transfer at the Same Time as I Create a US Side to my Account?

Even though I contacted InvestorLine using a toll-free number, and even though there was no wait time (!) to speak to an agent, I still combined my requests into a single call.

So yes, you can request the creation of a US side to your account during the same phone call as you request a transfer of some shares from the Canadian side of your account to the yet-to-be-created US side. How efficient!

What Happened the Business Day After I Requested the Transfer to my New US Dollar Sub-Account

So I made the request to create a US side for my account yesterday, on Thursday.

Today, on Friday, I logged in to my InvestorLine RRSP account to see what had changed. Here’s what I found:

Request made July 11 2013 to transfer 100 shares of TD when I called to create the US ledger.

On the morning of July 12 2013, as warned, I can see two line items in
my Transaction History:

Transaction Date: July 11, 2013
Settlement Date: July 11, 2013
Activity Description: Transfer out
Description: Toronto-Dominion Bank
Symbol: TD
Quantity: -100
Price: blank
Total Amount: 0.00 C

Followed by another line item
Transaction Date: July 11, 2013
Settlement Date: July 11, 2013
Activity Description: Transfer out
Description: Toronto-Dominion Bank
Symbol: TD
Quantity: 100
Price: blank
Total Amount: 0.00 U

NOTE: They BOTH say transfer OUT.

When I look at My Portfolio > Holdings
In the Cash balances section, there is a new line
Description / symbol: U.S. $ Cash
Quantity: 0.00
Average cost: blank
Current price: 1.0380 C
Market value: blank
Unrealized gain/loss: blank
Unrealized gain/loss %: blank
Portfolio %: 0.00%
Details: blank
Action: blank

Not surprisingly, the Cash equivalents and Fixed income sections are the same as always.

In the Equities section, there is a change.
I had requested they transfer only 100 shares of my TD holdings from the Canadian side to the US side of the account.

So this morning there are two lines for TD:

Description / symbol: Toronto-Dominion Bank – TD
Quantity: (original balance less 100 shares)
Average cost: same average cost as all week
Current price: 84.88 (yay! I bought during the dip!)
Market value: an enormous sum
Unrealized gain/loss: another enormous green amount
Unrealized gain/loss %: +4.36% (this is a blended average from multiple buys and sells)
Portfolio %: ***%
Details: two clickable icons
Action: the list is asking me to Select a chosen task if desired.

And the second line

Description / symbol: Toronto-Dominion Bank – TD
Quantity: 100
Average cost: same average cost as all week
Current price: 84.88
Market value: 8,488.00
Unrealized gain/loss: +354.36
Unrealized gain/loss %: +4.36%
Portfolio %: ***%
Details: two clickable icons
Action: the list is asking me to Select a chosen task if desired.

At this point, it looks like I still own 180 shares of TD in the Canadian side of my ledger.
That’s what they warned me when I requested the transfer after phoning in. Apparently on Saturday or Monday (he said “the next day”) I should see the Canadian TD shares vanish and the American TD shares appear.

Stay Tuned!

I’ll update this when the shares appear on the US side and describe how they are displayed and/or where.

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Do you find it tricky to remember you no longer own certain shares in your Canadian trading account because they’ve been journaled to the US side but they are still misleadingly displayed as Canadian? Have you ever sold shares you don’t have? Please share your experiences with a comment.